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metalburn
Joined: 09 Jun 2007
Posts: 46
Location: italy
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 Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 4:09 am Post subject: Is "Heaven and Hell" greatest Hard Rock album of e |
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I think Heaven and Hell is also now, the best Hard Rock album of History, never I've listened something like that! What do you think about it?
ps
excuse me for bad english.
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panayiotis1984
Joined: 11 Aug 2006
Posts: 640
Location: Somewhere in your dreams...
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:33 am Post subject: |
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True, excellent album... but can we labeled it as the best rock album ever ???
I mean, i can think many albums that REALLY rock...
As for a start, have you listened the Holy Diver album ???
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Magica Dragon
Joined: 19 Jan 2007
Posts: 626
Location: England
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:47 am Post subject: |
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I think to classify something as the greatest of its genre it has to be groundbreaking and to a certain extent original. Heaven & Hell wasn't really either of these........not to say it's not a bloody brilliant album, classic in fact, but it was nothing new and there are better albums out there. But we all have opinions. Best doesn't mean favourite 
Die Young, Nean Knigts and Children Of The Sea are some of the best tracks Sabbath ever recorded. Then there's the title track...........a masterpiece  |
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stargazer81
Joined: 01 Jun 2007
Posts: 31
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 11:48 am Post subject: |
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for me the best is rainbow rising and then long live rock and roll...
but i think heaven and hell is also a masterpiece..i love this album
but my favoyrite hard rock album is long live rock and roll... |
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ManOnTheSilverMountain_DP
Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Posts: 1419
Location: Rome, Italy
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 12:06 pm Post subject: |
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Well, IMO, yeah... it's the best HEAVY METAL (not Hard Rock) album ever!
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metalburn
Joined: 09 Jun 2007
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Location: italy
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:14 pm Post subject: |
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It's very difficult to find the border between HR and HM, and Heaven and Hell is the classic example. In my opinion Walk Away, Wishing Well, Children of the Sea, Lonely... Lady Evil can be HR, Neon Knight and maybe also HaH are Heavy Metal.
However this record is an work of art. I'm sure abour it.
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ManOnTheSilverMountain_DP
Joined: 26 Mar 2006
Posts: 1419
Location: Rome, Italy
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:22 pm Post subject: |
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| metalburn wrote: |
It's very difficult to find the border between HR and HM, and Heaven and Hell is the classic example. In my opinion Walk Away, Wishing Well, Children of the Sea, Lonely... Lady Evil can be HR, Neon Knight and maybe also HaH are Heavy Metal.
However this record is an work of art. I'm sure abour it. |
By the way, welcome!!! I'm glad you're Italian because until you wasn't a member of this forum I was the only Italian here and I felt... lonely! 
Magic!
Mario
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metalburn
Joined: 09 Jun 2007
Posts: 46
Location: italy
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:52 pm Post subject: |
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Welcome you too!
I'm new member of this site but I love Dio from 1981 when I bought On Stage, some months after Rising and Heaven and Hell .
Today I still love these records like (maybe more) those days!!!
to soon
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metalburn
Joined: 09 Jun 2007
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Location: italy
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 1:54 pm Post subject: |
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Sorry, I 've forgotten to say you my name: Umberto .
ciao!
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ManOnTheSilverMountain_DP
Joined: 26 Mar 2006
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 2:06 pm Post subject: |
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| metalburn wrote: |
Sorry, I 've forgotten to say you my name: Umberto .
ciao! |
Ciao!!!
[Ciao in Italy means Hello/Hi]
Magic!
Mario
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alitivity
Holy Diver
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 1945
Location: Cleveland Ohio
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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| Magica Dragon wrote: |
I think to classify something as the greatest of its genre it has to be groundbreaking and to a certain extent original. Heaven & Hell wasn't really either of these........not to say it's not a bloody brilliant album, classic in fact, but it was nothing new and there are better albums out there. But we all have opinions. Best doesn't mean favourite
Die Young, Nean Knigts and Children Of The Sea are some of the best tracks Sabbath ever recorded. Then there's the title track...........a masterpiece |
I have to disagree, H&H was original and ground breaking. There were heavy albums before it, but that particular album helped shape the sound of heavy metal from that point on. There hadnt been an album like it before. so many years later its hard to imagine that music like this wasnt common at that time, but it wasnt. In fact, Geezer Butler had left Sabbath and wasnt sure he was coming back until he heard what Ronnie and Tommy were putting together. Also to say it wasnt ground breaking isnt right either. Lets not forget that Sabbath was pretty much in the toilet at that point. H&H redefined their very existance. the album set the stage for the most celibrated version of Sabbath next to the original. I dont know if its the greatest Heavy Metal album ever, but I know that somewhere down the line it influenced the greatest Heavy Metal album, whatever it may be!
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f22chris
Joined: 27 Aug 2005
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| Posted: Mon Jun 11, 2007 8:30 pm Post subject: |
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It's an amazing album, but I do have to say I prefer Holy Diver any day.
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Magica Dragon
Joined: 19 Jan 2007
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Location: England
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 2:01 pm Post subject: |
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| alitivity wrote: |
| Magica Dragon wrote: |
I think to classify something as the greatest of its genre it has to be groundbreaking and to a certain extent original. Heaven & Hell wasn't really either of these........not to say it's not a bloody brilliant album, classic in fact, but it was nothing new and there are better albums out there. But we all have opinions. Best doesn't mean favourite
Die Young, Nean Knigts and Children Of The Sea are some of the best tracks Sabbath ever recorded. Then there's the title track...........a masterpiece |
I have to disagree, H&H was original and ground breaking. There were heavy albums before it, but that particular album helped shape the sound of heavy metal from that point on. There hadnt been an album like it before. so many years later its hard to imagine that music like this wasnt common at that time, but it wasnt. In fact, Geezer Butler had left Sabbath and wasnt sure he was coming back until he heard what Ronnie and Tommy were putting together. Also to say it wasnt ground breaking isnt right either. Lets not forget that Sabbath was pretty much in the toilet at that point. H&H redefined their very existance. the album set the stage for the most celibrated version of Sabbath next to the original. I dont know if its the greatest Heavy Metal album ever, but I know that somewhere down the line it influenced the greatest Heavy Metal album, whatever it may be! |
True, good points but it was only their best charting since Sabotage for example so at the time I don't think it had a huge impact commercially. Also I don't think it really redefined metal to be honest. I'm not saying it wasn't pure class but just not redefining. Not many albums did that.......Kill 'Em All, Iron Maiden, British Steel for example. Just my opinion though |
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alitivity
Holy Diver
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
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Location: Cleveland Ohio
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| Posted: Fri Jun 15, 2007 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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I have often said that Dio didnt create Heavy Metal, he just gave it a personality. The heaven and Hell album is a classic example of this. Im not sure if the albums you quoted would exist without the personality Dio and the heaven and Hell album gave to Metal. Thats obviously my own speculation, but Priest really didnt kick into metal gear until after H&H. I remember Halford with his hippie look and flowered shirts.
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edgeoftheworld
Joined: 29 May 2007
Posts: 82
Location: Witch's Valley...
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| Posted: Sat Jun 16, 2007 8:16 am Post subject: |
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You can't say one album is the best of its genre, because their are so many great artists of the HR/HM music.
So, perhaps it could be one of the best albums Ronnie ever did with Sabbath, but on the other hand, Holy Diver could be the best he did with his solo career.
I like so many artists of Heavy Metal and Hard Rock, so this is difficult for me.
I can only say that it is one of his best with Black Sabbath, his best with Black Sabbath for me was Mob Rules.
edgeoftheworld 
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