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DevinMacGregor
The Cap'n
Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Posts: 2195
Location: SoCal
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 Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 5:30 pm Post subject: |
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| The Sentinel wrote: |
| thecoop wrote: |
Oh, and Bible Black is a fantastic song, and I like the fact that Black comeas after Bible in the title - I feel it adds to the impact. |
I think putting Black and Bible arse-about-face alludes to the darker subject matter that this song so clearly touches on than if the title had been "Black Bible"
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Yes, so do I, feel this way. Bible Black could denote how a book is and/or how a book is read whereas Black Bible others might view that we have a White Bible and Ronnie is referring Anton LaVey's Black Bible.
And btw it is addiction not a diction. The lyric sheet on the album sleeve has addiction while from fans I am seeing a diction. One has religion replaced with a vision as well.
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jpjohn
Joined: 28 Sep 2004
Posts: 29
Location: The Last In Line
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| Posted: Sat May 30, 2009 11:40 am Post subject: |
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| The Sentinel wrote: |
The thing that really intrigues me with this song is the tenses that it's written in.
The first and last sections are written in the third person singular with the middle section in the first person singular.
I can't seem to recall Dio ever having written lyrics in this manner previously, although please correct me if I'm wrong about this, and I would love to hear his reasons for penning in such a style.
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I think "Don't talk to Strangers" is like that.. |
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alitivity
Holy Diver
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 1945
Location: Cleveland Ohio
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| Posted: Sun May 31, 2009 6:24 pm Post subject: |
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Here is a thought, Ronnie often write one thing that seems to point you in a direction, but he actually means something totally different. A title like Bible Black automatically makes you think something sinister. However, think about this:
The most popular binder covering for the Holy Bible is Black, so Bible Black could just be the color of the book itself. Also looking at the lyrics, you could take the perspective that this person is a tortured soul, who feels himself slipping into darkness and is looking for Divine inspiration, and trying to break free from the darkness.
Just a thought 
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DevinMacGregor
The Cap'n
Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Posts: 2195
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Sun May 31, 2009 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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I agree with you that this person has issues and is seeking answers but I do not think the bible black is meant to be good. I agree it more than likely has a double meaning.
This person finds the bible black and:
"And the first page says beware you've found the answer
The next one says I wish that you were dead
Don't go on, put it back, you're reading from the Bible Black"
That would imply the book is contradictory. We then move on to:
"Let me go, I've seen religion, but the light has left me blind
Take me back, I must have the Bible Black"
This would imply the bible black is his religion and the light that he thinks he sees has actually made him blind. We then move on to this:
"Let me go, I've found addiction, and it makes me feel alive
Take me back, I must have the Bible Black."
This is what a lot of people do when they find religion. They become addicted to it. Now before I get accused of slamming your faith construct I had a friend who had a meth addiction. He went to rehab. When he got out our friendship was rekindled. I had started getting into miniature gaming. This became in a way his bible black. It was his new religion and it was his addiction. He wanted to play 24/7. So much to the point he lost a union job.
See my friend was seeking answers, the problem was the answers were inside of him and he used something else to feed his addiction just to feel alive and never cure himself.
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alitivity
Holy Diver
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 1945
Location: Cleveland Ohio
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 10:06 am Post subject: |
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"And the first page says beware you've found the answer Most religious minded people believe all the answers are in the Bible
The next one says I wish that you were dead If you were dead and religious, you would be rewarded in death by going to heaven
Don't go on, put it back, you're reading from the Bible Black" In todays rapidly growing athiest society, reading from the bible seems a little taboo, and religious people are made to seem foolish so they are told to keep their views to themselves
That would imply the book is contradictory. The bible has always been contradictory in its interpretation
"Let me go, I've seen religion, but the light has left me blind
Take me back, I must have the Bible Black" This could have a couple of meanings. one being blinded by all the bad things that come with organized religion and trying to find the true meaning in the book, or being blind to the true meaning and following what has been taught to the point that you cant live up to expectations and you are trying to get back into the good grace
"Let me go, I've found addiction, and it makes me feel alive
Take me back, I must have the Bible Black." When a person finds faith they often have the conviction to make their life better even if its just their own mental state that makes them feel alive, and they want more of this feeling so they dive deeper into their religious study and mindset
Of course this is my take on it, and that means nothing, but the fact that I can find something to relate to in this song while others get different meanings is the mastery of RJD, and thats what makes his lyrics so GREAT!!!!!
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The Sentinel
Joined: 05 Sep 2006
Posts: 733
Location: If I'm on-line, sat at the pc
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| Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 2:12 pm Post subject: |
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| jpjohn wrote: |
I think "Don't talk to Strangers" is like that.. |
Just been listening to, and thoroughly enjoying again, DTTS and it's all in the first person.
Thanks for the post tho, gave me a damn fine reason to listen to a superb song yet again.
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Sick of all of this
The suffering and we just carry on
Isn't it time we care and lose the hate
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nunoni
Joined: 15 Feb 2008
Posts: 150
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| Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 1:45 am Post subject: |
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| DevinMacGregor wrote: |
I agree with you that this person has issues and is seeking answers but I do not think the bible black is meant to be good. I agree it more than likely has a double meaning.
This person finds the bible black and:
"And the first page says beware you've found the answer
The next one says I wish that you were dead
Don't go on, put it back, you're reading from the Bible Black"
That would imply the book is contradictory. We then move on to:
"Let me go, I've seen religion, but the light has left me blind
Take me back, I must have the Bible Black"
This would imply the bible black is his religion and the light that he thinks he sees has actually made him blind. We then move on to this:
"Let me go, I've found addiction, and it makes me feel alive
Take me back, I must have the Bible Black."
This is what a lot of people do when they find religion. They become addicted to it.
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hmm... I find myself agreeing that this is a very good interpretation, not the only possible one (after all, with Dio there are always many superimposed meanings), but a really well thought one; Altivity's, which goes more or less in the opposite direction, seems to me to be more stretched.
You should post it in the Sabb forums as well, some people there tend to diminish Dio as a lyricist so it's good to throw some light at them.
(well; he didn't do himself any favour with "You're on a caravan to Superman", perhaps it's an allusion to Sunset Superman?) |
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Holymagica
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| Posted: Wed Jun 03, 2009 2:21 am Post subject: |
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Why does everyone think its the Holy Book they are singing about in Bible Black 
It could be any book.... 
There 100s of books out there that call themselves 'bibles'.
Dennis Wheatley's ''The Devil and all His Works'' is a bible of information or the it could be Aleister Crowley's book of Magick.
I also believe that using the word 'black' is more to do with a mood than colour.They want to give importance to that mood,thats why I think they are using the word 'black' giving the book a macabre and angry feel to it.Thats the main reason I don't think the song is about the Holy Book. |
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DevinMacGregor
The Cap'n
Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Posts: 2195
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 6:52 pm Post subject: |
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| Holymagica wrote: |
Why does everyone think its the Holy Book they are singing about in Bible Black
It could be any book....
There 100s of books out there that call themselves 'bibles'.
Dennis Wheatley's ''The Devil and all His Works'' is a bible of information or the it could be Aleister Crowley's book of Magick.
I also believe that using the word 'black' is more to do with a mood than colour.They want to give importance to that mood,thats why I think they are using the word 'black' giving the book a macabre and angry feel to it.Thats the main reason I don't think the song is about the Holy Book. |
Which is what I was saying when I included the example of my friend who took miniature gaming as his new religion. I largely stopped playing because of him. It does not even have to be a book. Warhammer 40K became his new religion. It blinded him to so many other things like losing his marriage and losing his union job. He found addiction and it made him feel alive. It was his bible black.
Do I agree the word black denotes mood? Sure.
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Smacks & Manly Thumps,
The Cap'n
Sons of Griogair
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Bobby66
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 439
Location: Hades
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| Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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| DevinMacGregor wrote: |
| Holymagica wrote: |
Why does everyone think its the Holy Book they are singing about in Bible Black
It could be any book....
There 100s of books out there that call themselves 'bibles'.
Dennis Wheatley's ''The Devil and all His Works'' is a bible of information or the it could be Aleister Crowley's book of Magick.
I also believe that using the word 'black' is more to do with a mood than colour.They want to give importance to that mood,thats why I think they are using the word 'black' giving the book a macabre and angry feel to it.Thats the main reason I don't think the song is about the Holy Book. |
Which is what I was saying when I included the example of my friend who took miniature gaming as his new religion. I largely stopped playing because of him. It does not even have to be a book. Warhammer 40K became his new religion. It blinded him to so many other things like losing his marriage and losing his union job. He found addiction and it made him feel alive. It was his bible black.
Do I agree the word black denotes mood? Sure. |
...Wow!...i've never heard of a friggin' video game destroying someones life?!
...but I completely agree with this anaology... 
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DevinMacGregor
The Cap'n
Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Posts: 2195
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2009 9:26 pm Post subject: |
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| Bobby66 wrote: |
| DevinMacGregor wrote: |
| Holymagica wrote: |
Why does everyone think its the Holy Book they are singing about in Bible Black
It could be any book....
There 100s of books out there that call themselves 'bibles'.
Dennis Wheatley's ''The Devil and all His Works'' is a bible of information or the it could be Aleister Crowley's book of Magick.
I also believe that using the word 'black' is more to do with a mood than colour.They want to give importance to that mood,thats why I think they are using the word 'black' giving the book a macabre and angry feel to it.Thats the main reason I don't think the song is about the Holy Book. |
Which is what I was saying when I included the example of my friend who took miniature gaming as his new religion. I largely stopped playing because of him. It does not even have to be a book. Warhammer 40K became his new religion. It blinded him to so many other things like losing his marriage and losing his union job. He found addiction and it made him feel alive. It was his bible black.
Do I agree the word black denotes mood? Sure. |
...Wow!...i've never heard of a friggin' video game destroying someones life?!
...but I completely agree with this anaology... |
It is 3D gaming. This is played on a table top. Oh I loved it. It had this pseudo history behind it. It started off as a role playing game you did on the table with miniatures but people were playing it as a heads up one on one wargame.
I started with their 6mm version of the same genre. I got him into it because I wanted to start a gaming club with each of us taking the different races and building the armies up. I was wanting to get into gaming design. I saw flaws and was looking at ways to enhance the game experience for people. I wrote a bunch of alternate rules and conversion rules for previous editions but that is another story.
Warhammer 40,000 is the larger scaled game that takes place in the year 40,000+ CE. A war torn universe. I wanted to just kick his ass for Epic and wanted to go to this larger scale which he told me he was not going to do. I win most of my games and am a damn good dice roller as well. He would bitch whether he was winning or losing. For me it was all about being fair and if a situation came up even if it hurt me and I felt that rule was unfair in that situation I would talk with you about altering the rule to be more fair.
He wanted to play 24/7. He worked swing so before work he would try to find someone who was available to play. He started to miss his start time and then he missed the time that he would get marked absent whether he showed or not. For each offense he goes to a step. Step 5 is the end and termination follows. Well he got terminated. This is a hobby Bobby and expensive. You have to collect the figures, assemble and paint them. I spent 1000s of dollars in the early to mid 90s. I made terrain as well. I still have boxes of it in the garage. Styrofoam hills of different thickness, trees, war torn walls, brush, buildings, etc. Instead of paying bills he would buy figures behind his wife's back. Well they eventually got divorced.
I eventually developed a rule: I do not play with him or against him. He never could figure what I meant though. Others laughed at it. He was never really a team player and when you were setting up he would move around the table to give his pieces the best positions. He as well would cheat. I would watch him play with other players. I would see him cheat. So when we played well I make it a point to go out of my way to make sure you know what I rolled. I even roll in the box lid of the game ON the table. I may out maneuver you on the table top but I will not beat you by cheating you on the basic mechanics of the game. If I beat you it is because I honestly beat you. He did not care. If you beat him he would whine you always win. If he beat you he would practically dance on the table like the fucking munchkins as if a house just fell on the witch. Oh but you could never smile if you won.
I had great games with other people. It is just a tight knit group and if someone was hosting a game when the dick was there. At the store, he was there. He had a meth problem once and was forced to go to rehab by that same union job. He got cleaned up but this is how he approached almost anything. It was like an addiction. Same gaming circle got into Ultima Online. For a year he kept pestering me to play. So I finally get an account. We then move over to Everquest. Now I will put the shit down. I will walk away and go outside. The last time I talked to him was in 2003 and he was taking a week off just so he could go from level 64 to 65. I mean what the fuck. I just gave up calling him or going over there.
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Smacks & Manly Thumps,
The Cap'n
Sons of Griogair
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Bobby66
Joined: 14 Jun 2008
Posts: 439
Location: Hades
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| Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 5:59 am Post subject: |
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...Jesus...  ...you only needed to say one word...METH!...  ...I've seen it destroy countless people!...I had a friend that burnt his father's house up cooking it!...he got three yrs in the Joint....got out, & returned to the same shit...he was just recently arrested again for manufacturing...he's gone for a long time now... 
" took him to a place we dont belong"
...as for your friend and this game...I just dont understand?...how the Hell do you give up everything over this?...either he's a complete idiot...(which sounds about rite from your descriptive)...or maybe this game just makes him happier than anything else?...sounds like to me that he will end up playing "alone" though...sad... 
"At last alone his fire's dying, burned another day"
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Holymagica
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| Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 8:33 am Post subject: |
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Okay what are you thoughts on Atom and Evil
Blue skies, once upon a dream
All eyes never in between
Then into the garden came the spider
"I'm here for you," said the spider to the fly
And when I'm through, you can open up your eyes to see
Your world on fire, and the liar won't let go
Atom and Evil
One more promise
We can tame the sun
And then we'll shine forever
Someday you can cry for everyone
We'll burn when you were clever
Oh!
Expand your mind, we've got a place for you
Just make believe that one and one are always two
When into the parlor comes the spider
Just say NO!
Atom and Evil!
Falling's easy
Rising will never be
So we must rise together
Here are the changes
Powerful harmony
But then there's no forever
Atom and Evil!
Maybe if we cry together
Maybe if we cry as one
The tears will fall to chill the fire
And keep everyone from
Atom and Evil
Atom and Evil
Atom and Evil
Atom and Evil!
I am sure someone in here said it was about WMD.
But I just think its a 21st Century version of the Book of Genesis  ...well not all it but the story of Adam and Eve 
I also think the kiss with Doctor Manhattan and The Silk Spectre
in the movie Watchmen would make a great music video for this song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vP_dlspyKcU
And with the Atom bomb going off in the background as they have good snog |
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DevinMacGregor
The Cap'n
Joined: 29 Sep 2004
Posts: 2195
Location: SoCal
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| Posted: Fri Jun 05, 2009 10:51 am Post subject: |
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I think it is using the image of the story of Adam and Woman but the story is about Atomic Energy. This is the spider coming into the flies. Atomic Energy is taming the sun since the energy it gives off is hotter than the sun. So by proxy a nuclear reactor is taming the energy the sun would give off.
Blue skies would be everything was great and fine beforehand with the garden referring a much simpler life(subjective though) Atomic Energy may bring us electrical power that we need but it as well can gives us weapons that not only can obliterate us at a greater ease but all species on this planet.
Look at the countries that want it and countries that are pushing for these weapons. We have Iran that is saying oh no we only want it for energy and not weapons. As the Spider says to the Flies, I mean UN. *wink* And did Iran not just test a rocket that can reach Israel?
We as well have North Korea that has the bomb. Here is another spider telling the flies oh no we won't develop for weapons and they have.
So the Atom has great potential to help us but it as well can be used for Evil. The Atom itself could be the spider and the flies are our goodwill. The first nuclear reactor built was I believe in 1942 and helped power Chicago. It was built for peaceful means but then three years later we dropped two atomic bombs on Japan. A few years later Russia had the bomb and btw that was the reason why the US who was at war with China by proxy did not bomb Chinese cities (conventional). We were worried that the USSR who now has the bomb would get involved.
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The Cap'n
Sons of Griogair
http://www.atheists.org
http://www.clangregor.org/famous.htm
http://www.merchco-online.com/metalbladerecords/
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nunoni
Joined: 15 Feb 2008
Posts: 150
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| Posted: Mon Jun 08, 2009 2:18 am Post subject: |
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| Holymagica wrote: |
Why does everyone think its the Holy Book they are singing about in Bible Black
It could be any book....
There 100s of books out there that call themselves 'bibles'. |
well yes, but "bible" is, first and foremost, the Christian holy book. So, you may interpret as you wish, but it is very hard to get around the fact that it is the word "bible" that is in the title of the track, so to start with, any interpretation should start there, and then add something to it while including it. |
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